Went cold turkey and was depressed, low energy, had brain fog for 3 months. It was terrible. I was def abusing daily.
After the third month of zero caffeine my energy levels sky rocketed, mind was sharp, and felt incredible. Better than when my caffeine sensitivity high.
Blueberries, exercise, decent sleep are better for daily performance with some caffeine to max out performance as needed.
Thank you for highlighting this.
But that daily coffee with a zyn puch is so tempting....
#1 for me has always been camping or trekking. Bring enough coffee for a single cup a day for the first day or two and then go cold turkey. It physically forces you to stop.
Black tea & Skoal/Grizzly Pouch was my thing for about a decade and a half. I had one of the nastiest spitters on a rather large trading floor. It was a source of high honour.
super interesting article... I genuinely enjoy having a cup of coffee in the morning moreso purely for the sake of it than performance, will definitely test cutting back. no doubt it effects your skin / dehydrates you significantly.
Went 10 days off recently, was doing like 3 cups of coffee per day. Coincided with ibuprofen for back injury so didn't feel too much headache, and had CBD + melatonin ready to get me to sleep.
Overall life has improved, anxiety & mood swings are gone, evening energy crash is gone, and focus is better. I restarted caffeine and now limit my intake to 1tsp green tea/mate + 1-2 decafs per day. Ideally consumed before 15pm.
Adds up to about 60-80mg of caffeine, vs. the 300-400mg I was casually and randomly consuming before.
Remember the goal is to minimize nasty sides from it, not necessarily quit completely. Keep experimenting to see what works for you, ideally keeping consumption below 100mg/day.
Some of the stuff this post doesn't mention:
1. If you have ANY anxiety & mood swings, caffeine is a likely cause
2. Coffee gives you energy crashes vs. smoother high from Tea & Mate (although they're easy to overdo as well, esp. mate)
3. Measure out the caffeine you consume, e.g. 1tsp of green tea = 50mg, have those numbers in mind
4. Removing caffeine (especially coffee) tremendously improves sleep quality & the ease of going to sleep
There's a book about this called "Caffeine Blues". A bit too detailed, so should be "required skimming" instead of "required reading". Interesting fact - the author drinks a 1 cup per day these days in the morning, even though his book absolutely smashes caffeine from all angles.
Alex Becker has spoken about it in some videos.
Can recommend 10+ days off for everyone who drinks caff daily (which is nearly everyone). Get decaf coffee, decaf green tea to push you through it, and some light sleep aids (mag, cbd, theanine) if necessary.
The sleep improvement is so large for me, especially compounded, that it’s probably a huge net benefit to go back to sparing use. It’s just become part of my day to have a coffee/mate in the morning and espresso after lunch… tough stuff to quit.
Played D1 college soccer 2013-2017 and can confirm caffeine consumption at the wrong time was a huge thing
5 mins before game and halftime break we’re the ideal times to be at peak performance throughout the game
Always at risk of a bad muscle cramp in the 80th minute or so, probably because of the dehydration
Aderrall was actually the more common choice however, because of the focus and endless energy it would offer. 90 minutes of full concentration. I didn’t ever try addy for the games but the games I had some pre workout caffeine were my highest performing moments no doubt
Anyone able to add detail to the stomach issues that come from not shaking up energy drinks beforehand? Just general uncomfortableness from the bubbles, or actual “issues” with digestion? I’ve always done this just for preference and people look at me like I have 2 heads.
Carbonation can cause cramps. "The gas creates bloating, or inflammation in your gut, which then reflexes into your muscular system and back. This can cause back pain, neck pain, headaches, and an overall feeling of stiffness and tightness."
Side Note - I am currently in a very abusive cycle with stimulants (caffeine primarily, also some nicotine) due to the amount of pressure and work required In my business right now.
Working on breaking the cycle. This hit home for sure
Yeah that lines up figured there is a different stim for that. It seems like its ideal for about 15-20 minutes. Wish this information was available decades ago would have made a difference for sure.
yeah it was actually more effective coming off the bench because you could time it perfectly.
*Coach tells you to warm up* - ok time to start sipping on your gatorade bottle with pre workout in it, 10 minutes later you're warmed up and feeling the effects.
Get subbed in for a 15 minute sprint and it's halftime or the game is over.
Positions that didn't get subbed and needed 100% focus (defense and center mids) ripping addy and smelling salts before the game.
Wingers and strikers needing to make a quick impact caffeine / pre workout.
It is a shame there weren't more hacks publicly available. You just had to want it enough and experiment with what might work for you. Spring season (offseason) was peak experimentation at practice to see what produced the best results.
NCAA was testing for weed in the offseason anyways, but technically caffeine was an illegal substance you could test positive for after games if there was too much in your blood
That makes sense, also wondered if soccer ever ran EPO like Lance Armstrong. Know the whole Messi story on HGH but guessing that EPO is also used in that sport
Been off of it for almost 10 years now, got plenty of weird looks from normies when I was still working W-2. It's a useful drug when used as described in the post, but have more energy off of it. Can dose 20 - 30mg when needed with smaller drawbacks, tea or a low sugar soda.
Personal thing that I noticed is when back on it, there's a "consumption period" at the end of the day. When off I can be productive until the hour before going to sleep. When on anything around dinner or later is shot and filled with a strong desire for passive consumption e.g. TV, videogames, purposeless social media. Things that normally are not compelling to me.
Unrelated to the post, but am curious as to whether the ease of programmability in Boomers is at least partially due to this effect. The old formula of fatigue (night) + rhetoric + authoritative figure seems more potent when the subject is already predisposed to consuming things
Does nicotine - Zyn Pouch /Chewing Gum / Patch make a better safer replacement for caffeine. Seems to give similar positive effects but not sure about the extent of the negative effects (higher blood pressure, narrowing of arteries seem to be some of the side effects).
Some people also swear by using L - Theanine supplements to get the same effects around focus and performance as in caffeine.
There are many countries in Europe where drinking shots of espresso is the cultural norm. Health data should be easily available, and I doubt it’s negative.
L-theanine is most commonly stacked with caffeine rather than taken independently for focus in my opinion. Green tea by default, but energy drinks like Celsius include a fair bit. Does wonders to offset caffeine jitters and “tame” the caffeine down a bit.
Somehow, L-Theanine, this boring natural supplement is one of my top 3 favorites.
This post really hits home. Have been abusing it the last year (tripled my nw 🤷♂️). Noticed whenever I fly for work twice a month I don’t consume any caffeine on those days and my body feels like I did some hard full body CrossFit workout + have a mild headache, and sleep 12h that night.
Addition on benefits: Can improve your bed game with the ladies. Just make sure you know it’s not that time of the month... having your heart pounding mercilessly while getting head isn’t a relaxing time.
As far as caffeine for physical performance, it's been proven ad nauseum that it is a significant performance enhancer for endurance exercise, both aerobic and anaerobic work. Can guarantee you every Tour de France rider is 1000% on caffeine. Interestingly enough these aerobic performance improvements also do not attenuate with tolerance increase, the one caveat being that tolerance does affect anaerobic/strength work but most likely because of it's effects on mood and perceived energy vs. any actual mechanism in force output.
TLDR: Caffeine for aerobic performance = PED. Caffeine for anaerobic performance = Good as long as you don't have tolerance
This so true. Sporadic use is the best.
Went cold turkey and was depressed, low energy, had brain fog for 3 months. It was terrible. I was def abusing daily.
After the third month of zero caffeine my energy levels sky rocketed, mind was sharp, and felt incredible. Better than when my caffeine sensitivity high.
Blueberries, exercise, decent sleep are better for daily performance with some caffeine to max out performance as needed.
Thank you for highlighting this.
But that daily coffee with a zyn puch is so tempting....
Extremely hard to break the cycle, another advantage of being homeless
Being homeless or always on the move changing scenery is the best way to shake most addictions.
Even if living in fancy hotels, just the constant change of pace distracts from the patters that cause the addiction.
😉
#1 for me has always been camping or trekking. Bring enough coffee for a single cup a day for the first day or two and then go cold turkey. It physically forces you to stop.
zyn and a coffee is righteous until i found out that nicotine is a caffeine inhibitor!
Black tea & Skoal/Grizzly Pouch was my thing for about a decade and a half. I had one of the nastiest spitters on a rather large trading floor. It was a source of high honour.
super interesting article... I genuinely enjoy having a cup of coffee in the morning moreso purely for the sake of it than performance, will definitely test cutting back. no doubt it effects your skin / dehydrates you significantly.
You'd have to use the caffeine to test if you get a boost at some activity
Then get off for a few weeks then repeat process, will see the improvement that way
There's also coffeine-free coffee, tastes the same in my opinion.
Yep
could you try rotating decaf on 50-75% of the mornings to see if it impacts anything?
Went 10 days off recently, was doing like 3 cups of coffee per day. Coincided with ibuprofen for back injury so didn't feel too much headache, and had CBD + melatonin ready to get me to sleep.
Overall life has improved, anxiety & mood swings are gone, evening energy crash is gone, and focus is better. I restarted caffeine and now limit my intake to 1tsp green tea/mate + 1-2 decafs per day. Ideally consumed before 15pm.
Adds up to about 60-80mg of caffeine, vs. the 300-400mg I was casually and randomly consuming before.
Remember the goal is to minimize nasty sides from it, not necessarily quit completely. Keep experimenting to see what works for you, ideally keeping consumption below 100mg/day.
Some of the stuff this post doesn't mention:
1. If you have ANY anxiety & mood swings, caffeine is a likely cause
2. Coffee gives you energy crashes vs. smoother high from Tea & Mate (although they're easy to overdo as well, esp. mate)
3. Measure out the caffeine you consume, e.g. 1tsp of green tea = 50mg, have those numbers in mind
4. Removing caffeine (especially coffee) tremendously improves sleep quality & the ease of going to sleep
There's a book about this called "Caffeine Blues". A bit too detailed, so should be "required skimming" instead of "required reading". Interesting fact - the author drinks a 1 cup per day these days in the morning, even though his book absolutely smashes caffeine from all angles.
Alex Becker has spoken about it in some videos.
Can recommend 10+ days off for everyone who drinks caff daily (which is nearly everyone). Get decaf coffee, decaf green tea to push you through it, and some light sleep aids (mag, cbd, theanine) if necessary.
The sleep improvement is so large for me, especially compounded, that it’s probably a huge net benefit to go back to sparing use. It’s just become part of my day to have a coffee/mate in the morning and espresso after lunch… tough stuff to quit.
The business model of caffeine is fascinating to study:
Highly addictive Ingredient (legal) + Consumable product (daily consumption, sometimes multiple times) + Automated machinery (press a few buttons, instant coffee) + Multiple variations (lattes and espresso, etc demand premium pricing + emotional (branding + “comfort” + loyalty rewards “gaming” programs)
Study how Dunkin, Starbucks, coca-cola, Red Bull, etc have dominated the game and you had your answer to a business idea
Played D1 college soccer 2013-2017 and can confirm caffeine consumption at the wrong time was a huge thing
5 mins before game and halftime break we’re the ideal times to be at peak performance throughout the game
Always at risk of a bad muscle cramp in the 80th minute or so, probably because of the dehydration
Aderrall was actually the more common choice however, because of the focus and endless energy it would offer. 90 minutes of full concentration. I didn’t ever try addy for the games but the games I had some pre workout caffeine were my highest performing moments no doubt
Anyone able to add detail to the stomach issues that come from not shaking up energy drinks beforehand? Just general uncomfortableness from the bubbles, or actual “issues” with digestion? I’ve always done this just for preference and people look at me like I have 2 heads.
Carbonation can cause cramps. "The gas creates bloating, or inflammation in your gut, which then reflexes into your muscular system and back. This can cause back pain, neck pain, headaches, and an overall feeling of stiffness and tightness."
https://www.drsinett.com/blog/carbonation-.a-pain-in-your-back
Side Note - I am currently in a very abusive cycle with stimulants (caffeine primarily, also some nicotine) due to the amount of pressure and work required In my business right now.
Working on breaking the cycle. This hit home for sure
Yeah that lines up figured there is a different stim for that. It seems like its ideal for about 15-20 minutes. Wish this information was available decades ago would have made a difference for sure.
yeah it was actually more effective coming off the bench because you could time it perfectly.
*Coach tells you to warm up* - ok time to start sipping on your gatorade bottle with pre workout in it, 10 minutes later you're warmed up and feeling the effects.
Get subbed in for a 15 minute sprint and it's halftime or the game is over.
Positions that didn't get subbed and needed 100% focus (defense and center mids) ripping addy and smelling salts before the game.
Wingers and strikers needing to make a quick impact caffeine / pre workout.
It is a shame there weren't more hacks publicly available. You just had to want it enough and experiment with what might work for you. Spring season (offseason) was peak experimentation at practice to see what produced the best results.
NCAA was testing for weed in the offseason anyways, but technically caffeine was an illegal substance you could test positive for after games if there was too much in your blood
That makes sense, also wondered if soccer ever ran EPO like Lance Armstrong. Know the whole Messi story on HGH but guessing that EPO is also used in that sport
Probably, but I never got to that level to know for sure.
A couple of my buddies went on to play pro / still play so I will have to ask them off the record when they retire in 3-5 years.
One plays EPL so the highest of levels, I'm curious as well. I have to assume so
great post enjoyed a different topic
Been off of it for almost 10 years now, got plenty of weird looks from normies when I was still working W-2. It's a useful drug when used as described in the post, but have more energy off of it. Can dose 20 - 30mg when needed with smaller drawbacks, tea or a low sugar soda.
Personal thing that I noticed is when back on it, there's a "consumption period" at the end of the day. When off I can be productive until the hour before going to sleep. When on anything around dinner or later is shot and filled with a strong desire for passive consumption e.g. TV, videogames, purposeless social media. Things that normally are not compelling to me.
Unrelated to the post, but am curious as to whether the ease of programmability in Boomers is at least partially due to this effect. The old formula of fatigue (night) + rhetoric + authoritative figure seems more potent when the subject is already predisposed to consuming things
good post. Noted same. Like a consumption zombie walking at the end of the day.
Everything in moderation..including moderation.
Does nicotine - Zyn Pouch /Chewing Gum / Patch make a better safer replacement for caffeine. Seems to give similar positive effects but not sure about the extent of the negative effects (higher blood pressure, narrowing of arteries seem to be some of the side effects).
Some people also swear by using L - Theanine supplements to get the same effects around focus and performance as in caffeine.
Anything that boosts or changes your chemistry should be cycled is our standing theory
There are many countries in Europe where drinking shots of espresso is the cultural norm. Health data should be easily available, and I doubt it’s negative.
It says caffeine you could switch to decaf.
L-theanine is most commonly stacked with caffeine rather than taken independently for focus in my opinion. Green tea by default, but energy drinks like Celsius include a fair bit. Does wonders to offset caffeine jitters and “tame” the caffeine down a bit.
Somehow, L-Theanine, this boring natural supplement is one of my top 3 favorites.
This post really hits home. Have been abusing it the last year (tripled my nw 🤷♂️). Noticed whenever I fly for work twice a month I don’t consume any caffeine on those days and my body feels like I did some hard full body CrossFit workout + have a mild headache, and sleep 12h that night.
Addition on benefits: Can improve your bed game with the ladies. Just make sure you know it’s not that time of the month... having your heart pounding mercilessly while getting head isn’t a relaxing time.
Overall good read. Might make it after all)
Reading this while suffering from a caffeine withdrawal headache because I only drank 100mg compared to the usual 400mg lol
Pain
Yeah caffeine, alcohol and stevia gotta go
Why Stevia?
Can you get into TRT? You mentioned you went off... would love to better understand, as you mentioned no one is doing it properly
Not going to do that for free still doing work on that stuff
BowtiedLoon has some content on that
Took Feb off from caffeine after this post. Long overdue, been 5-10yrs of 1-2gram/day.
Massive improvement by end of month. Brain fog, skin, sleep, stress/anxiety/high-strung feeling.
That last was the biggest one. Was actually way more productive off caffeine due to lower stress level.
Will be adding back a bit now, maybe 2x/week, but usually green tea / yerba mate during wifi money work sessions, instead of coffee/5hr energy.
lol, you had to drop this after I ordered 4kg of Yerba Mate.
New goal: Have these 4kg of Mate last 4 years.
I'll report back in 2028 ;)
As far as caffeine for physical performance, it's been proven ad nauseum that it is a significant performance enhancer for endurance exercise, both aerobic and anaerobic work. Can guarantee you every Tour de France rider is 1000% on caffeine. Interestingly enough these aerobic performance improvements also do not attenuate with tolerance increase, the one caveat being that tolerance does affect anaerobic/strength work but most likely because of it's effects on mood and perceived energy vs. any actual mechanism in force output.
TLDR: Caffeine for aerobic performance = PED. Caffeine for anaerobic performance = Good as long as you don't have tolerance